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File Ref. #079 A . '/ 1 r 4~ \ 2 3 ORIGINAL 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 CITY OF MIAMI BEACH 11 DESIGN REVIEW BOARD 12 t -~ 13 14 15 TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS OF 16 WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 8TH, 1997 17 12:40 A.M. - 1:28 A.M. 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 ( , \. 25 " H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 Si \ ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 ( 25 2 1 MR. MOONEY: Okay. The Board will need to 2 continue the four other matters to a date 3 certain on November 4th before it adjourns. 4 MR. SCHULMAN: Mr. Chairman, may we speak? 5 With all due respect-- 6 MR. GROSS: Yeah, please. 7 MR. EICHNER: After that, we would both 8 like to be heard. 9 MR. GROSS: Absolutely. 10 MR. SCHULMAN: My name is Cliff Schulman, 11 for the record, 1221 Brickell Avenue. 12 We are two agenda items away from being 13' heard today. With the utmost of respect to the Board and Mr. Cypen, we, as you have, have been waiting eleven and a half hours. We have flown down our principals from New York. We have flown down Mr. Helmut Jahn from Chicago at substantial cost and expense to be here today and have attempted to wait patiently to be heard today. We need to be heard today. We think it is only fair and proper that we be heard today. We understand, and I am sorry, I know the Board is tired, as am I. MR. GROSS: I'm prepared to stay here until H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 \ 13 ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 ( 25 3 1 6:00 in the morning. 2 MR. EICHNER: Mr. Gross, we wouldn't ask 3 you to stay until 6:00 in the morning, and I 4 wouldn't ask Mr.-- 5 MR. CYPEN: I'm not going to stay past 6 12:30. It's 12:30. I think eleven and a half 7 hours is enough. I can't do it, you I can't. 8 know. 9 MR. EICHNER: Mr. Cypen, could you--I would 10 like--I sat here for-- 11 MR. SCHULMAN: Let me introduce 12 Mr. Eichner, who is a principle in Continuum, who has been here from New York all day waiting. Mr. Jahn is here, for the record, from Chicago, and his staff, and Mr. Eichner's staff has been here all day, and Mr. Eichner wishes to speak. MR. GROSS: Okay. MR. EICHNER: Gentlemen, we've sat by patiently here. Now I have certainly'listened to presentations in front of the New York City Planning Department, the New York City Planning Commission, the Landmarks Preservation Commission, the Board of Standards and Appeals. I listen to you all have a.discussion for H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( '. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13' 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 4 two hours and 15 minutes on a matter. The discussion related five times to an adjournment, which could have, might have, should have been taken. That is not my business, but we certainly are entitled. I respect the fact that it is late. It is certainly late. It is late for Mr. Jahn. I have an 8:00 plane in the morning. It is patently unfair to the public, to people who have come, who have made an application, who have filed boards. We have five different sets of people who have waited here. We would like 15 minutes. A presentation, that is what we would like. We don't want you to approve anything. We are not on for any action this evening, but I think that it's not fair to other people. I can't ask you how to allocate your time as to what amount of time you spend on Item "X" or Item "Y." It would have been inap~ropriate of me to turn around and say, Gentlemen, please make a motion, you obviously are not going to get a fourth vote. That was patently clear an hour and 15 minutes ago. You chose, as is your right, - to go through H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 5 to get to an adjournment, which pushed you well past Mr. MR. CYPEN: Cypen. MR. EICHNER: --Cypen's 11:00 desire, which then became 12:00, which then became 12:30, and remarkably, had the humor to make a comment about which was why I was smiling 20 minutes ago, but we would like to be heard. And at the risk of the fact that having been heard at 12:30 at night, that I'm not listening--I'm not being heard by a group of individuals that is particularly motivated to hear us, and my architect doesn't particularly want to make the presentation at 12:30 because we think we are trying your patience. On the other hand, the project that we are talking about is probably the most significant piece of land'in South Beach. How it gets to be 16th on an agenda that starts at 1:00 in the afternoon and ends at 12:30 at night is remarkable to me. New York would provide some sort of special meeting a week later. You all don't seem to have the mechanism to do that. But I ask you-- MR. GROSS: We do. We do. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 . ( 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( MR. EICHNER: 6 Well, then perhaps, perhaps--and I don't want to stand here at 12:30 at night and Helmut Jahn doesn't. MR. CYPEN: we might give it. You are taking up whatever time does that mean? You say you are not on for approval. What MR. EICHNER: this isn't for an approval. We're on for presentation MR. SCHULMAN: Board-- MR. CYPEN: MR. SCHULMAN: Morton Towers. This matter was before the What item is this? This is the next item after MR. CYPEN: It says requesting design review approval. It's not for approval? MR. SCHULMAN: Board. MR. EICHNER: explain. MR. SCHULMAN: MR. EICHNER: MR. SCHULMAN: This item was before the Perhaps the City Attorney may May I explain? Yes, sir. This item was before the Board in September and was recommended to be deferred by the staff until November. We H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( ( '. heard this month for Board 7 2 input before it came up for final approval. 3 MR. CYPEN: Is Morton Towers here also? 4 MR. SCHULMAN: Yes, Morton Towers is here. 5 MR. CYPEN: Do they want to be heard? Do 6 you want to be heard? You are ahead of them. 7 Do you want to be heard? 8 MR. ZYSCOVICH:' At this point, you have 9 heard enough from me, and I am tired. 10 MR. CYPEN: You have ahead of them, do you 11 want to be heard? 12 MR. ZYSCOVICH: Let me ask you something. 11 How late are you staying here? 14 MR. EICHNER: Answer the question, please. 15 Answer the question, yes or no. 16 MR. GROSS: Well, Steven? I will stay here 17 as long as we need to stay here to hear whatever 18 applications we have to hear. I feel that we 19 have that responsibility to the public, because 20 as Mr. Eichner said, if we can't arrartge our 21 time, that is our problem. I don't think the 22 public should suffer for that. 23 MR. EICHNER: The architect said he would 24 pass. 25 MR. GROSS: But I don't speak for the Board H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 l ( \ ( . 8 1 members. 2 MR. CYPEN: You want somebody who can 3 listen, who can pay attention, can digest, and 4 can understand what you are saying, don't you? 5 MR. EICHNER: Absolutely. 6 MR. CYPEN: If you had an operation 7 scheduled by the surgeon and he had rough day 8 and he said, you know, I just can't quite cut 9 open your heart. And you say, Look, I am here 10 on the table. Just go ahead and cut, I don't 11 care, right? 12 13' MR. GROSS: Okay. So what happened to Morton Towers? 14 MR. EICHNER: Mr. Cypen, they said Pass. 15 they would pass. 16 MR. CYPEN: I believe you. I will leave at 17 1:00. 18 MR. GROSS: We have to see whether Peter 19 will stay as well. 20 MR. EICHNER: We will take 15 minutes and 21 not more than that that we will graciously-- 22 MR. BLITSTEIN: There are still other 23 people to be heard. 24 MR. EICHNER: They are the applicant after 25 that. I don't know which one. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( , 9 MR. CYPEN: It is two after them. MR. BLITSTEIN: I just want to kno~ one thing, that is if we're going to stay for the whole agenda, because I really can't stay. I have got to be somewhere in the morning, too. MR. EICHNER: Can we make a suggestion constructively then? Is there something before November? Do you do that? MR. GROSS: We do have a special meeting process. MR. MOONEY: We couldn't notice a meeting before November 4th. MR. GROSS: I'm sorry. You can't notice it. MS. MARTINSON: You don't need to notice it. Let's hear the people that have flown in from out of town and then make arrangements for the local peo~le. MR. GROSS: All right. I think that makes eminent sense. Mr. Jahn has come here from far away. Mr. Eichner has ..1 mean, let's hear the people from out of town, and let's see who else might be here, if we have to hear, if we will hear some other people. MR. CYPEN: Well, Morton Tower graciously H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13' ( 14 15 16 17 18 19. 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( \ 10 passed. Morton Towers, do they have to be heard before November? MR. ZYSCOVICH: Yes. MR. CYPEN: Lucerne Hotel, are they here? Do they have to be heard before November? Everybody does, of course. Claire Fishbein? MR. FISHBEIN: Here. MR. CYPEN: Hi, Claire. MS. MARTINSON: Everybody has to be heard. Let's just agree upon a date. MR. CYPEN: Of course, everybody has to be heard. MS. MARTINSON: Right. I mean, it's Okay. money. They have got to move with their projects. MR. GROSS: Okay. MR. CYPEN: Make your presentation you wish to be heard. MR. SCHULMAN: Okay. Thank you. . We will start. Mr. Chairman, Members of the Board, again, for the record-- MS. GRUB: Hold on one second, Cliff. Is Morton Towers being formally cori~inued? H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( .' ( 11 MR. GROSS: Yeah. 2 (Thereupon, a motion was made, seconded, 3 and passed to continue Morton Towers.) 4 MR. GROSS: Now let's hear File No. 9193, 5 which is the Ocean Parcel. 6 MR. SCHULMAN: Mr. Chairman and Members of 7 the Board, my name is still Cliff Schulman, 1221 8 Brickell Avenue, and I appreciate your patience 9 and I appreciate your understanding and I 10 appreciate your public responsibility. We will 11 try to make it short. 12 The Ocean Parcel is an important piece of , 13 property. It is 18 acres of land that is 14 located on the ocean at the point of South IS Beach. 16 Just for clarification, so we are all 17 operating under the same operating 18 understanding: the 18 acres of land which 19 constitutes the Ocean Parcel is in fact the 20 entire parcel of property that presently 21 contains Portofino Tower~ South Pointe Tower, 22 and approximately 12 acres of vacant land which 23 is sometimes referred to as the Ocean Parcel. 24 But in point of fact, the entire lot is 18 25 It is zoned CPS-3. Under the present acres. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 12 1 zoning code, that would allow 2.5 FAR, up to 3.5 I \ 2 FAR for the entire site, which is 2.8 million 3 square feet that has been zoned for this 4 property. It has unlimited height, as you are 5 aware of, and to date, what has been built and 6 is reported in the Staff Report is approximately 7 900,000 square feet. Don't hold me to the exact 8 numbers. It is too late. Approximately 900,000 9 square feet. 10 We submitted plans to the City in August 11 and have submitted additional information in 12 September. We wanted to come to the Board and C' 1~ requested the opportunity to present where we 14 are today to get some feedback so that in 15 November we can come back to you with as full a 16 presentation as we can. 17 Just so you are aware, Staff comments did 18 include some zoning comments. We have taken 19 those comments seriously and have even submitted 20 in another application, which will be 'heard 21 before you in November, for lack of a better 22 term, an as-of-right zoning plan. 23 The plan that Mr. Jahn is going to discuss 24 with you tonight would require certain (' 25 variances. We understand that. The as-of-right H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 .,." ( ( 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 ( 25 ", 13 1 plan, we believe, would not and is being 2 reviewed by staff. We think one is better than 3 the other. We are going to ask you to approve '4 both ultimately in November. 5 Mr. Jahn, I don't know if he needs any real 6 introduction, but we have his resume. He is a 7 world renown architect from Chicago. 8 Mr. Eichner, I think you have met somewhat 9 briefly before and is a well-known developer in 10 the northeast. 11 Without any further adieu, I would like 12 Mr. Jahn to take you through the planning 1:1 process, see if we can get some feedback. 14 Helmut, rock and roll. 15 MR. JAHN: Thank you. I appreciate your 16 patience, and I think I am probably going to make a little different presentation now than I would have. MR. SCHULMAN: Eleven and a half hours ago. MR. JAHN: But one thing I can assure you is that I have not lost any of the enthusiasm of this project. Ever since we started our work in May, and I knew that site before, I realized what a H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 14 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 It ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 { difficult problem that is. This is a project which, one, humbles you as an architect, but at the same time, excites you. And I think this project needs a vision. It needs a vision which elevates urban design and architecture in kind of a new level, and this is very much the mind set I have kind of approached this project. This is not a project which kind of should look back into history. It should not recycle history. This is a project of a different I scale, of a different size, and every time you look back in history, there is a question about the propriety of what you use from history. There is a question about scale and relationship to scale. There is a question about the reality and working to obtain a different time and different technology, and we are going to have to believe that \we can advance urban design and architecture to a different level. I think this project is this important that it should put--that the world should ultimately talk about it. That may sound very arrogant and very presumptuous, but quite frankly, from little beginnings in Chicago and throughout the United States, I've worked throughout the world, H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 Ij ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 15 we do most of our work in the nation, and what I really appreciate is doing work in the United States which could be at a level of importance. Now, the strategies in a project can be summarized with three different levels of importance. One is urban design. One is architecture, and the third one is deals with materials, construction, and technology. Let me talk about urban design first. Here is a street map of South Beach, and when we come to the parcel. It may be,missing a detail. It isn't very obvious, but there is one decision to be made, and maybe I'll put this model in front of you here. You maybe can pass it around. Don't tip it too much because this is removable. We concentrated the buildings and arranged the buildings along the City's city grid. This is some photos I took a while ago. Tnis obviously is looking down Collins Boulevard, and this is a view down Collins Boulevard where you see the buildings, and this is a view down Ocean Drive, and this is a view down Ocean Drive with the buildings here. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 16 1 What was very important to us is to keep on 2 Collins and to keep on Washington keep the view 3 corridor open. You see Fisher Island at the 4 end, and the buildings are moved to the east, 5 and quite frankly, that is why we need the 6 variance in terms of the setback. 7 So the alignment with the City grid, that 8 opens the view corridor, and then the 9 separation, the next one, between the entry into 10 the buildings and the ocean front drive. 11 This is another view. This is a view from 12 the northwest from the harbor. This is the way , 13 the South Pointe development looks right now, ( 14 Portofino development, and this is with the 15 buildings. 16 And this is the next one here. I'm rushing 17 through in the interest of time because I know 18 we will be appearing before you before. 19 This is a computer view of Portofino, South 20 Pointe Towers is to the right. This is the 21 building massing, which you see in the model. 22 There is a base structure which is two stories 23 high. Here, four stories high. There is a ramp 24 going up. The towers are aligned, and then ( 25 between that entry situation and that kind of a H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( l, 19 20 21 22 23 24 ( 25 17 1 terrace situation theY're building, there is a 2 large ocean front garden between the water and 3 the buildings. 4 And this view here is a view from the 5 east. You see the three towers which form an 6 assembly which is quite strong. 7 Maybe at this particular point, I should 8 talk about some of the architectural elements. 9 Let me put this one here. No. No. Leave this up. Thanks. As you can see in some of these renderings--give me this one here .' Okay. The 10 11 12 1:1 next board. The--when I talk about a new kind 14 of an architectural attitude, I'm talking about 15 buildings which are dealing with some of the 16 real problems which I consider important when 17 one talks about tall buildings. 18 First, it's all triangular. This is a shape which maximizes exterior exposure, minimizes interior space. Then the other thing is we're dealing with light. We are dealing with a very special situation you have here. Miami light creates reflections, creates rapacity. Light creates transparency. Light comes from'the outside and H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ,". 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 , 13 ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 18 from the inside, and the probable material we are using is glass. Glass, in a way that it kind of goes beyond the boundaries of the buildings and protects some of the balconies, goes beyond the top of the building, screens the penthouses, becomes--gives the building a kind of immateriality, makes the mass kind of less and creates through the play of the sun and the light and the clouds, creates colors, which are inherent in the building and not applied. One particular element, which we probably did the most work on which makes the ,building specifically Miami and makes it a building which you would not do in Chicago or New York or in other climates is extending the living environment to the outside with the balconies. This is a detailed view here. Now, in difference to almost every building here, which has a concrete slip that comes out. Here we are dealing wi th a kind of gri'd or metal, which is like a clip-on structure which is put on the structure, when then in turn supports a metal flooring, and the railings are of glass shading elements which creates a kind of level of layers which makes the building even H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 \ ( ( 19 intriguing and it makes more detailed. 2 It gives the building a kind of life which 3 comes outs of its construction and comes out of 4 its materials and it is not applied and not 5 taken from some nostalgic element from the 6 past. 7 This is a particular view of the corner 8 where you see the triangular balcony, which this 9 building has a very large balcony' which is 10 supported by this large structure. So it is not 11 an inherent part of the building. It is an 12 applied part of the building, and that part of 1:1 the balcony is screened by this glass wall, 14 which you see for instance here. is The balcony 15 behind. It makes for a very interesting living 16 condition. 17 It makes protection, and it's a building 18 sun shading with glass with a frit applied to it 19 which means it is like a coating which you can 20 vary in terms of the density. 21 So the other construction parts of the 22 building, maybe I should--I just wanted to get a 23 glimpse on these elements here. This is, for 24 instance, a plan off the corner of the 25 building. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 (' \ ( 20 1 So what I am presenting to you here at this 2 very early stage is not just a kind of a fiction 3 or a vision, as I said before, but we have 4 ,actually gone into a lot of detail because this 5 part of the building is the building. It either 6 works or it doesn't work, and you can see that 7 some of these balconies are like French 8 balconies. This is Some balconies are deeper. 9 the corner balcony. That balcony is actually 10 more than three feet away from the screen wall, 11 so it is not an enclosed space of the building. 12 This is actually open here all the way down 13 the building. This is some--if I could just put 14 them up here. This is sections here, elevations 15 from the different sides. 16 This is another one and this is--this is 17 two boards here which shows some of the 18 materials, and I have to admit that some of 19 these materials are mostly taken from other 20 jobs. Like in any architect's work, there is a 21 continuity. There has to be a continuity, but 22 what you do always get adjusted to a particular 23 locale, and obviously when I say it is a vision, 24 there is something special about this particular 25 project which comes only out of this site and H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 \ 21 this locale is that you finally can have a building where you can open the windows. and go out on the balconies and can deal with the ,shading of the sun and where you can give the building a life that you could never do in Chicago or New York or virtually the northern cities where you have to count the balconies as FAR, which you don't have to do here. Put that one over here. So this is some of the materials. You know glass, it's glass elements in sections like the balcony elements of shading. This is when the glass is fritted. It is a lighter fritted. It's a darker frit. It is just stripes, or it can be any pattern. This is like the spando beams. Some of the glass is not clear glass. It is a tinted glass, and some of the glass is an opaque glass. So when I say a glass building, it is not all transparent. There is some perforated metal around the penthouses, glass is sometimes held by special fixtures, which is just point supported, and then this artificial and man-made materials will come to the site,mixed with natural materials in the landscaping. There H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 22 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 l will be different stones from like black to white and very light gray. There will be wood blanking. There is ,stainless steel mesh on the parking garage. And in areas where we don't have room for a lot of planting, we actually do what I call main scape. We grow in plants with man-made support so that we can get lush, green. It makes no sense on top of a parking a garage to plant this much so that--so the landscaping is actually what adds color to the project, between the wood and the different stones, and then opposite the color of the different planting, color of the sand, and ultimately the color of the water. This is a building which reflects. Both whichever way you look at it, the sun and the sky becomes the real life into it, and this shows you actually the separation what I said before. This is an entry dr~ve. This is a ramp going up. I think you saw that on the model, and then there is a throughway here between--continuing Ocean Drive all the way over to the park. This is a pedestrian access. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 23 1 The ramp goes over it but also lets light ( 2 into it, and from this ramp, you come into entry 3 courses. Courtyards is the lower one. This is 4 ,the higher one. From there you access the 5 building, and then you can go a step lower and 6 you come into a terrace area, and then you come 7 in a very free landscape park area. There is 8 different swimming pools allocated to the 9 condominiums and to the hotel, and then the 10 landscaping comes much more freer as we get to 11 the dune and as you get to the beach front. 12 MR. GROSS: Okay. Maybe I will stop you 13 there because I think you said most, and if you ( 14 want to get some feedback, I think that now is 15 probably the time to do that. So I don ,at know. 16 Maybe we will give a couple of minutes, if 17 somebody wants to say something publicly that 18 has waited here, and then we will get some Board 19 comment, you know. 20 Randall, did you want to say something? 21 MR. ROBINSON: Yes. I have to say I am 22 rather shocked because one of our comments was, 23 Wouldn't it be a great idea to have a pedestrian 24 connection from the south end of Ocean Drive to 25 the park, so nix that one. I think that is ( H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 24 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 \ great. However, it is a massive building, and we are opposed to it because of its size. It is a beautiful design. Although I was disturbed by your comments about not borrowing from history because you did the Chrysler building twice in Philadelphia, and it was very successful. So we know borrowing from history can work. It's a beautiful design. It is an overwhelming building, so we are opposed to a development of this magnitude. The shadows will be huge. Excuse me. I am a little out of breath. We believe the perspectives are a little bit deceiving. That perspective south dn Ocean Drive, even though the view corridors are continued, it looks--I have to say even though it is a beautiful picture it is almost like a nightmare scenario. We have to see not one, not two, but three very, very tall buildings there. So I guess the following--what follows is that perhaps the towers should vary in design and somehow break up the visual of uniformity. Also we felt that the triangular shape is misleading because even though in plan it looks H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( ( 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 25 1 thin, perhaps because of the way it is cited, 2 you create a wall effect, and I think that is 3 what I mentioned when you showed that south 4 looking view from Ocean Drive. But the 5 continuation of Ocean Drive through to the park 6 is really an excellent thing. 7 MR. GROSS: Okay. Thanks, Randall. 8 Does anybody else want to say something? 9 If not, let's get some Board comment. 10 Susanne. 11 MS. MARTINSON: Can I ask for clarification 12 on just a couple of things? 13 In your use of the extension of the glass 14 on the side where you have the--I don't know the 15 terminology. Where you painted in your 'density, densifying the glass and the shape control, does that happen on every plane of the building and it is always an extended window wall? MR. JAHN: Let me show you a plane. MS. MARTINSON: While you are looking for that. I will--I just want to ramble on about it. MR. JAHN: You can see it actually here. MR. GROSS: Please speak into a microphone. So grab that. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( \ 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 1 MR. JAHN: You see that happens in every 2 The balcony always projects out, and corner. 3 there is always one wall flush with the 4 building, and the other side is like I said, a 5 clip on, and I didn't mention it, but the 6 tallest tower is the condominium tower, and the 7 middle tower is the hotel, and the lower 8 portion, that is why it doesn't have any 9 balconies. And the upper level, a timeshare, 10 and it has smaller balconies. So there is this 11 in-depth architectural concept, a lot of 12 variety, and the varieties will be even further 13 accentuated, and obviously we are not at this 14 point yet. 15 There are three different levels or 16 apartments anticipated. Smaller ones in the 17 bottom, larger ones in the middle, and the big 18 ones on the top. And they in turn will change 19 this balcony structure in terms of that, except for the corner balcony, which always has the mixture of the balconies and the French balconies will change, and that will give the building-- MS. MARTINSON: A slight variation. MR. JAHN: --an inherent variety, which is H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 \, ( 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 27 1 again, honest and not implied, and I am very 2 confident that the building can take, as you 3 want, the variety, which the building as an 4 apartment building can take anyway because of 5 somewhat different shading devices and different 6 occupances. 7 Okay. MR. GROSS: 8 Well, the buildings have a MS. MARTINSON: 9 very crystallin kind of appearance and this 10 ephemeral kind of look, and while I applaud the 11 pedestrian access to the park--and I'm curious 12 as to selection of three towers, because we have 13 got the two existing buildings down there. And 14 this is such a prominent point for all of Miami, when you are on Key Biscayne, another is~and further to the south, and it becomes the keynote building because of the height, its entrance into the Port 'of Miami. And it is interesting that you put the third building to fill the void between the two, you know, so that one when sees it that you would see a space between it, and you know, that is filled. And I'm just--you know, from long distance viewing, because it does become the monumental marker to the entrance of the harbor H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( ( 19 20 21 22 23 24 ( 25 28 1 to Miami. 2 I have questions about the brutal heat 3 here, and you know, our weather conditions and, 4 you know, you do have shading devices and all of 5 that, and I think this whole building would be 6 in stainless, I would imagine, because of the 7 saltwater. 8 They're coatings right now, and MR. JAHN: 9 obviously I would love it in stainless if the 10 developer pays for it. 11 Right. I am just--I MS. MARTINSON: 12 appreciate the crystallin and the exactness and 13 the modernity of it, and it is timeless, but 14 then I have reservations about it as a statement 15 for Miami with this all-glass building on the 16 tip of Miami Beach because it becomes a very 17 symbolic building. 18 Come back to me while I formulate more thoughts. MR. GROSS: Well, you are saying you want to see more stucco in it? Is that what you are saying? MS. MARTINSON: You know, I just--I appreciate his system that he has developed here, and you know, in one sense, I love that H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( 13 ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 29 1 systemization of the building and the clarity of 2 the design, but I don't know. 3 MR. GROSS: It scares you? 4 MS. MARTINSON: Yes, it scares me. 5 MR. GROSS: Have you built this before? 6 MR. JAHN: No. I mean-- 7 MR. GROSS: The system, I mean. 8 MR. JAHN: As I said before, and some of 9 you are architects and you know you work with a 10 vocabulary. You find your vocabulary, and every 11 time because of a different locale, you see an 12 opportunity to expand this vocabulary. That is when you get really excited, and we are working on a building in Europe right now right, because you know, there is not so much buildings' in the United States which are glass buildings and, quite frankly, all those the problems with the heat and they 'can't devolve because glass is not of high efficiency. The reason why everybody wants to move in this building is because they want to see this beautiful setting. And like I said, there are sometimes kitchens or bathrooms on the outside, and it won't be all glass, and I can't tell you right now where exactly that is. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 30 1 It is a system. It is a kit of parts. ( 2 Like I showed you on the material board, I have 3 those parts and that is where I get the 4 variety. I don't make the variety. 5 The buildings is, as you said, clear and 6 honest. It is true and if I can make--I think 7 most of you, especially architects will know a 8 reference to a building which is today more 9 important, probably the best apartment building 10 which ever was built, at least high-rise 11 apartment building, is 860880 Lake Shore Drive. 12 That building was condemned in the passport of 13 time when everybody played around with history. ( 14 But today that building stands taller and bigger 15 and better. Another building like that 'is the 16 Seagram's Building in New York. I mean, Faller 17 Mushaw, Herbert Mushaw (phonetic) over a couple 18 of months ago: It is the best building, and it 19 was constructed in the last 40 years in New 20 York. 21 Now, I am not trying to kind of elevate 22 this on the same level, but like I said before, 23 if one doesn't try, one doesn't get to that 24 level. I don't think you should settle for that ( 25 kind of conformity, which I think--you know, I H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 31 1 hate to obviously sound a little bit critical, ~" 2 but what do you see going up here? 3 I mean, it is like in every city. It has 4 apartment buildings. The best apartment 5 buildings are still the ones from the '60s. 6 Some of this stuff, we can't afford today 7 except when we use a great deal of ingenuity, 8 and ingenuity applies to all kinds of levels. I 9 mean, it applies to, for instance, how we decide 10 a concrete structure. 11 I mean, we have managed--and I have done 12 some preliminary work to do the concrete 13 structure with one foot six sheer walls, not c. 14 three to four foot sheer walls like some of the 15 other buildings. 16 MR. GROSS: Okay. Let's get some other 17 feedback. William. 18 MR. CARY~ Mr. Chairman, I was hoping that 19 perhaps Mr. Jahn would share with the Board a 20 story that he shared with Tom Mooney and myself 21 when we reviewed this project in its earlier 22 stages which was his first exposure to the site 23 long before he ever realized he would be 24 designing a building on this site which was the 25 southern tip of this sand bar and this ( ~ H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 11 12 ( 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 ( ,. 25 32 1 experience of this kind of marvelous nautical 2 cell forms that are kind of resting against the 3 shore. 4 If you could perhaps talk about that a 5 little bit. 6 MR. JAHN: Well, I didn't want to bring my 7 personal-- 8 MR. CARY: Well, I think it is important 9 because of the nautical heritage of the beach. 10 MR. JAHN: I'm kind of expectant, but I am a sailor and I've been doing (unintelligible) for years, and about four years ago when we did it the first time, there was South pointe Tower there, and then a year after, Portofino Tower went up, and some of us architects were ~n a boat and we were surprised how big those buildings were. And then 'probably when Bruce called me up and he said, I have got the greatest site you can of, and when he told me, I knew right away. And when I say that I had a vision, I think it's because I had always the feeling that this point of Miami Beach is just so important. It is the causeway. It is where the boats come in. There is actually a lot of reference H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 33 for something tough and industrial. There is the harbor on the other side. There is all those great grains which move and down which you can see from those buildings in all of the photographs I took, and that is Miami Beach, too. It is a harbor town. To create something different, another dimension, you know, that the people hopefully will say and see that there is something else in Miami Beach. MR. GROSS: Okay. Let's get some input from Peter because he is the other architect here. MR. BLITSTEIN: I'm tired. MR. GROSS: I know. MR. BLITSTEIN: First of all, to make a comment, the level that you are at, it is very difficult because your work is so well respected, and I have studied your work for years, but I do have some issues, and I think that the building is beautiful and elegant and it is all the things you discussed. First of all, I don't think that Miami Beach or even for that matter, South Florida has very much of an industrial, pure industrial H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 , ~ 10 11 12 ( 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 ( 25 34 1 aesthetic. It is not the history of this area. 2 The area was developed with a lot of sort 3 of invented forms, but that is what we associate 4 with South Florida. I'm not saying you should 5 draw on those. 6 I think you should draw on the things that, 7 you know, move you, but I think when I look at 8 the buildings and I look at the forms and then 9 especially after you have mentioned that the buildings are different in function, that actually you have condos and timeshares, for me when I look at this, although I think they are absolutely beautiful and elegant, and technically how you're going to do it, I am sure they will be as fantastic as the other buildings. I would have much preferred, and again this is not predicating me approving it or not approving it, I would much prefer, other than if they are designed for reasons of wind or whatever, that they not take three exact forms, that when you look at them when they are paired together that they not become a complete wall, that they be looser. And technologically, I cannot argue with H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 35 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 ~ 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( the construction methodology. That is your choice, and I think it is a welcome change to the heavy stucco buildings that we have. But I don't like the fact that you have three. I take an exact opposite view of that. I don't think you ought to have three buildings that are exactly the same, especially after you are telling us that the center building has a different function. So for me, I think that that form, even if you took another one and you paired it back to back, I think that the forms can do whatever you like in a triangulated form or however you choose to detail it, which is beautifully elegant. But when I see those on that point, the don't, for me, as those elements, they feel too harsh, too raw, too industrial. As you said, the cranes at the other end of the port, for people that live in Miami, those are not visually exciting things that we want to see. We prefer that they not be there. You know, they are juxtaposed to a lot of things, so they are not really a sort of inspiration for most of us who live here. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( 10 11 12 13 ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 \ 36 1 I personally would prefer that they not be 2 there at all. So having said that, I think that 3 visually, not necessarily from an economic point 4 of view, because that drives Miami. But I think 5 that the detailing, the construction methodology 6 is very exciting. 7 I would like to see not three identical 8 forms, and I would like to see different forms 9 explored. That is just a reaction at this point. MR. JAHN: Obviously, I think you put it very well that aesthetic is something not to be argued about. Let me just respond to that question of like that density or the massing issue. Maybe first, the issue about the different shapes. We originally had a square and two triangles, and actually the longer we worked on it--it wasn't totally understandable. We actually has this square for the timeshare condominium, and for all kinds of reasons, I think it moved in the middle, and I think actually that the timeshare is what we said before. It's a real residential building at the end, and the hotel is to some degree a H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( 10 11 12 ( 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( \ 37 1 residential function. 2 I think, as all those renderings show, 3 because the buildings are turned to each other, 4 you never see them actually as triangular or 5 similar shapes because they are located in a 6 different relationship that develops actually a 7 lot of attention. 8 I think the model shows it. In terms of 9 that the buildings are close together, they are close together, but the amazing thing is actually, you see this here, that from every building, you have a totally unobstructed view. And that was obviously one reason why they are located this way, and that is by their density that they are here very dense, which loo~s maybe a little denser here, because you always have those screens at the ends, which are not really enclosed rooms. And the triangle actually, compared to a rectangle, has a lot of transparency because it has a varying GO-degree shadow angle. MR. GROSS: Okay I just want to move through because-- MR. JAHN: Excuse me. MR. GROSS: Okay. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 10 11 12 ( 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 ( 25 38 1 MR. JAHN: Mr. Schulman mentioned before 2 that we had done--this is theas-of-rights 3 scheme. The as-of-rights scheme, as you can 4 see, because it works within the setback lines, 5 it moves the whole development closer to the 6 existing Portofino and South Pointe 7 Development. These buildings are about nine 8 stories less. They are about 44. 9 MR. CYPEN: Each one is 44? It blocks the street end though. MR. BLITSTEIN: 54 and 40 as opposed to all 44? MR. JAHN: It blocks the street. No not that one. The other one. When you go down South Pointe, because it moves, it moves closer. It is right in the view corridor. What it does--you can see that actually better in the model. There is no way to access the building. There is no way to get a throughway. The building is shifted against the City grid because the setback line actually is to the property line and the beach front, and the entry drive is here, but there is no room here which H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 39 1 splits the building from the ocean front yard. ( 2 Actually, from an architectural po~nt of 3 view, it is the same set of parts. You know, it 4 is like a kit of parts. It is like hardware I 5 am using to put it on. 6 But to put another view on, take this view 7 here. No. No. No. The rendering from here. 8 This one. 9 And when you take the view from the 10 northeast, you see how much closer those 11 buildings get to the existing development. So-- 12 MR. GROSS: Yeah. Steve, do you have some 13 input? I think, you know, this is a better , \ 14 solution obviously. 15 MR. CYPEN: I think the-- 16 MR. JAHN: This plan is by rational, a 17 reason. 18 MR. -GROSS: Right. 19 MR. JAHN: This one-- 20 MR. GROSS: It is a function of the Code. 21 MR. JAHN: Is by circumstances, 22 accidental. 23 MR. CYPEN: I think the first solution is 24 better. I don't have any problem with three 25 identical shapes. I like that. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 1 \ 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ( 40 I just don't like what they are made out of. It just doesn't look like--if you'd put back the close-up of the--it is right underneath that one. It is right underneath it. No, with the metal, you know, where you see it up close. That. I don't know. I just--they look great when you don't see them that close.- Is that what they are going to look like? MR. JAHN: Keep in mind this is a computer rendering, which is obviously because it is blown up so big has a lack of resolution. What we would like to do is to build a better model for the next meeting on November . 4th, which for our own sake and for your sake, in order to testify. MR. GROSS: How much are you going to see into the apartments, and how much is the jumble of what people keep in their-- MR. JAHN: At 860880 Lakeshore Drive, that is a tall glass building with heavy emollients. That doesn't have the balconies. The balconies have the best shade. What is going to be part of that wall system is an internal shade system which you can do anything you want to do. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( 10 11 12 13 ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 (, 41 1 This not a see-through building. I mean, 2 sometimes these renderings obviously look a 3 little bit too controlled. I am not trying to 4 fool anybody, nor do I try to fool myself. 5 The buildings are going to have a lot of 6 variety. I don't think that because--you know, 7 sometimes one hates to eat one's own words. 8 When I mentioned the relationship to the grains, 9 I am not talking about an industrial structure here. This is going to be refined and sophisticated. MR. CYPEN: It looks industrial. MR. JAHN: I don't actually think it will look industrial in the sense that it doesn't like you want to live in it. I like to think of it like a car, like a well-designed tool. We all surround ourselves in our lives with those things. What I find--obviously, I am an architect who loves this kind of thing, and I get very frustrated that when everybody has a car or goes on an airplane, they have the latest product. But when it comes to a building, we all want to have wood and stucco, and we are all confident of what we had in the past, and I feel H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( 10 11 12 13 c 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ~ 42 1 sometimes like a missionary going out and-- 2 MR. CYPEN: I think you have done a good 3 job because it looks like-- 4 MR. JAHN: --and trying to recruit people. 5 MR. CYPEN: I think you've done a good job 6 because it looks like a Delorian. 7 MR. GROSS: Okay. 8 MR. BLITSTEIN: Can I ask you a technical 9 question just out of curiosity? I know you probably haven't gotten that far, but you know, we have excessive wind loads and there is a new code. I mean, there is no diagonal bracing? I don't know the size of the structure. I am just curious technically. MR. JAHN: I should just mention-- MR. BLITSTEIN: You talked about sheer walls. I understand, but still, I'm just curious. Technically, in a building whose structural members that appear to b~ so light, and I mean technically, I'm just curious how you physically build the whole frame for this building and be able to deal with the detailing that you are talking about. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( 10 11 12 ( 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 43 1 MR. JAHN: Quite frankly, in order to make 2 this building work is to put the money where it 3 counts, where you see it. You are going to save 4 the money where you don~t see it, ~nd that is 5 basically in the concrete structure, and when I 6 started to work on this building, I looked at 7 some of the other buildings like Portofino 8 Tower. It has three to four foot sheer walls, 9 and we were actually working with the construction engineer on that, but we are also working with a consultant that I have been working with in many buildings throughout the world and in Europe who heads up the Institute of Lightweight Construction (unintelligible). MR. GROSS: Okay. I don't want to awell on the technical at this hour. Really. MR. JAHN: I've got to answer it. (Unreportable group discussion) . MR. GROSS: You know what, forget it. MR. SCHULMAN: Peter" we agree to tell you after you vote approval. MR. GROSS: Let me ask you two other questions. You know, personally I think it is very bold and I like it. I mean, I think there is H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 44 1 certainly nothing else of its kind that is ( 2 around, and I like the fact that the buildings 3 are in their own vocabulary and they are 4 different than South pointe Tower and 5 Portofino. You know, there is a whole dialogue 6 the minute you try and make these different and how they are going to relate to the other buildings that are there. So I like the fact the compositionally they are their own, but there are some issues that 7 8 9 10 11 the Staff raises that I think are very important 12 which is how the project addresses the street, ( 13 how urbanistically friendly it's going to be. 14 I think there is a lot of work that's going 15 to have to go into making that happen. 16 MR. JAHN: But I think that we can present l7 this in November with your permission. 18 MR. GROSS: Yeah. 19 MR. JAHN: I think we also have to do a 20 little bit more work on it. As I mentioned 21 before, the base of the building which faces the 22 street only goes from here to here. It is only 23 two stories high, and we managed to take that 24 whole bulk of that parking garage and put it all 25 kind of back here. ~ H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 45 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 l 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Obviously, you know, we are working on the garage. You see those two walls here? .These are those green walls. These are those walls with sort of--the facades of the parking garage are actually green, and you are having a store front, having a retail here facing this street. And above here, I have that mesh, which is a transparent material which is a beautiful material, and we will be able to illustrate this. MR. GROSS: Okay. Given the hour, do we need to continue this? MS. MARTINSON: I just have one other. MR. GROSS: Yeah. Okay. MS. MARTINSON: The colors that you are depicting or the tone of the building, I would hope you would keep it this very light gray and not a colored 'glass or-- MR. JAHN: It is a gray and white. It is all what you want to see. MS. MARTINSON: Okay. Thank you. Thank you. MR. JAHN: It is gray. I think you do have that code where the glass has to have a certain degree of a tinting because of-- H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( (, 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 46 1 MR. BLITSTEIN: Reflexivity and-- 2 MR. CARY: Turtles can't see it. 3 MR. JAHN: That is right, the turtles and 4 the light. 5 If there is a way to change it--because 6 that is not necessary from an environmental 7 control. We have today glasses with lowey 8 (phonetic) coating, which are almost clear, and 9 have higher degrees of efficiency, like for 10 instance, like reflective glass had like five 11 years ago. 12 MR. GROSS: Okay. So I hope that we were 13 able to give you some input as to where the 14 Board members mayor may not be. There are 15 other board members who are not here. As always, there is no guarantee people won't have other or different feelings at a subsequent meeting, but I apologize for the l~te hour. It is certainly not your fault, and I am sorry that you had to wait so long, and you know, it is an honor for us to have someone of your stature present this kind of project. We certainly respect your body of work and we look forward to working through this process with you. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( ( 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 47 1 MR. SCHULMAN: Mr. Chairman, just before 2 you go on to another matter, just because 3 they've had the patience, as you have, to be 4 here, I just wanted to introduce the other 5 members of the design team. 6 Jose Suarez is here from Sieger 7 Architectural Partners, who is assisting in the 8 localized aspects of many of Mr. Jahn's design 9 elements. 10 E. B. Stone & Associates, our landscape 11 architects, again, have been brought in. I 12 think they are well known to you. 13 And Joe Pollock is here from Kimley-Horn, who has been our traffic engineer and has been working with the City extensively to do the traffic studies that are necessary to show that concurrency will be met when we come back before you the next time. MR. GROSS: Okay. Thank you. Does somebody want to make a motion to continue this? I guess it is on the agenda so we need to do that. MR. BLITSTEIN: Move to adjourn. MR. MOONEY: To continue it to November 4th. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 1 ( 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 48 MR. CYPEN: So moved. MR. GROSS: Okay. Is that what you want to do, you want to come back in November? MR. SCHULMAN: Yes, sir. We have the as-of-right plan coming back before you in November. We would like to have the opportunity to come back before you in November and-- MR. BLITSTEIN: They have already submitted the revised drawings. MR. SCHULMAN: Correct. We have submitted revised drawings to Staff, and there may be some changes between now and Monday even based upon some of the Board comments. MR. GROSS: I mean, November's meeting it seems to me is going to be pretty busy. 'So why don't--maybe we should do what we did in September, which is to have two meetings in November, one 'for the high-rise projects. MR. BLITSTEIN: I will have Chuck canvass the members to see if they are available. MS. GRUB: Tom, do you have time to do notices for that? Yeah? MR. MOONEY: Well, are we going to notice it the same way we did last time? MR. GROSS: Yeah, just to schedule them all H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( 10 11 12 ( 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 49 1 for early November. We continue the other ones 2 that we intend to do later. 3 MS. GRUB: You have to do that second 4 notice thing again. 5 MR. BLITSTEIN: No. We can't do that. We 6 have already begun sending out the notices for 7 the November meeting. 8 MS. GRUB: Right. See, what happened last 9 time because when we have-- MR. BLITSTEIN: No. As a matter of fact, we can't do that. We have already started sending out the notices for the high-rises on November 4th. MR. GROSS: Okay. Well, there are other technical solutions at an hour other than 1:30. Maybe that will be worked out. I am sure the lawyers can figure everything out. MR. MOONEY: Peter, before you go, ther~ are two projects that the Board either has to continue to November 4th or-- MR. CYPEN: We didn't even vote. MR. GROSS: Well, let's continue this. MR. CYPEN: I make a motion to continue to November 4th. MR. BLITSTEIN: Second. H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( 10 11 12 ( 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 50 1 MR. GROSS: Okay. Motion by Steve. 2 Seconded by Peter. 3 All in favor? 4 GROUP RESPONSE: Aye. 5 MR. GROSS: Opposed? 6 MR. CYPEN: I move to continue to November 7 4th the-- 8 MR. SCHULMAN: Thank you, Members of the 9 Board, for your patience. (Thereupon, the agenda item re Ocean Parcel was concluded.) H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997 ( 51 1 REPORTER'S CERTIFICATE 2 3 4 5 STATE OF FLORIDA 6 COUNTY OF DADE 7 8 9 I, AMY MASSENGALE, certify that I was 10 authorized to and did stenographically report the 11 foregoing proceedings and that the transcript is a (, 13 12 true and complete record of my.stenographic notes. 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 DATED this 27th day of October 1997. A ~..", 'II. .0 .6. ~''(. :~: "'t OF f~~"~ AMY L MASSENGALE My Commi..1on CC543978 Expir_ MM. 31, 2000 H. ALLEN BENOWITZ & ASSOCIATES Dade * Broward * Palm Beach (305) 373-9997