MB RDA MINUTES FEBRUARY 20, 1985 •
MIAMI BEACH REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY MEETING
February 20, 1985 - 9:00 a.m.
CITY HALL COMMISSION CHAMBERS
INDEX TO MINUTES OF MEETING
RESOLUTION PAGE
NO.
NO.
NONE
1. Roll Call - Meeting commenced 11:47 a.m. 1
all members present.
2. Acceptance of Minutes of February 6, 1985 1
meeting.
3. Report of Executive Director.
Deputy Director gave brief oral status reports on:
1) Coast Guard Property 1-3
2) Cheezem Development Agreement 2
3) South Pointe Park 3
4) Newman Contract 3
5) SSDI Lawsuit 4-6
6) Corridor Studies 6
7) Housing Authority Negotiations 18-20
(Copy of report filed with records of meeting.)
4. Old Business
a. Presentations on Corridor Studies by 7-17
representatives Land Design Research,
Inc. , Goodkin Research Corp. , and
Halcyon Ltd. (Corridor Studies team)
b. Agency recommendation to City Commission 19-20
to take immediate steps to commence
condemnation proceedings to acquire
property for vehicular-right-of-way for
marina from Housing Authority.
5. New Business - none 20
6. Report of Agency Attorney - none ?0
7. Adjournment - 1:18 p.m. (all members pre- 21
except for Mr. Daoud, who left the meeting
at 12:40 p.m.)
Next meeting: Wed., March 6, 1985, 9:00 A.M.
FH:lr
60 00Q44
SHOCKETT: I understand. Whatever you arrive at, we have tor •
Garner/Mason so that they don't . . . we don' t satisfy
have to make good on a
. . . . (inaudible -voices overlap)
PARKINS: Until we fulfill our obligation to that tenant.
SHOCKETT: But what I'm saying is, hopefully that all ofou are
the problems and if there's a Y aware of all
gun pointed at your head. . , . ,
FROMBERG: The point is well taken, Mr. Shockett. The documents
received last Friday, I believe, were just
PARKINS: Thursday.
FROMBERG: . . . .Thursday, and I want to assure all ofyou •
immediate priority by the CityAdministrationthat it received
and the City Attorney's office
and that ever since that moment they have been deeply involved •
their strategy from a legal standpoint P Y in determining
9 p int and are very, very aware of the
concerns of Carner/Mason and are addressing those concerns,
complicated issue and I'm sure thatyour but it's a
point is well taken and that is that
as soon as any decisions are reached, all of the Commissioners individually,
should be advised as to what's happeningso ►
that their concerns can be
addressed. We're all concerned about it but I just want
they' re on top of it and it is a complex issue. � to let you know that
SHOCKETT: Mr. Fromberg, let me just say, because I have
Weiner about this, and I did inno talked to Arnold
way intend to reflect that he is not on
top of it. He certainly is and I think he's doingan excellent •
but what I want to do isget out job with it,
in the record that there are these
problems and that we have to face them, and face them immediately.
Arnold's doing an excellent job. I think
WEINER: Mr. Shockett, thank you and I just want to
there's been any insufficiency assure you• that if
on our part it's been reporting back
individually to the Commissioners but rest assured that
addressed individuallyand the problem is being
more importantly collectively by the City
Attorney' s office and the Administration. We' re hand in hand on this one.
SHOCKETT: Speaking of that, can we get to the next item?
FROMBERG: Okay. What other items do you have, Mr. Fosmoen?
FOSMOEN: Mr. Mayor, I know that your agenda is beginning
we do have all of the consultants whog g to run late, hut
are involved in the corridor studies.
It was our intention to make a presentation which isoin to '
basis for much of the information at the Developer's
g provide the
eveloper's Conference. You' re
probably looking at a half hour's worth of time in order to bring
date on the design issues, market issues, the housing you up to
absorption rates and
the financial studies that have gone on for the last month
months since those contracts were entered into. and a half/two
FROMBERG: I think . . . can we postpone the Executive Session '
until after this
or what?
PARKINS: Well, you' re looking at what, 12:35, Richard. . . .
FOSMOEN: . . . (inaudible) we won' t take them off the hook and take k� them off
stage.
FROMBERG: Who's involved in the Executive Session?
PARKINS: Pete Hurtgen, a couple of staff people. I'll ask them to come in
at a quarter of one.
_
WEISBURD: One o'clock.
PARKINS: One o'clock.
FROMBERG: I think you ought to do it 1:45.
M.B.REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY 2/20/85 PAGE 6
6,
SINGER: This is the last item.
SHOCKETT: It's not the last item.
FROMBERG: It's not. We have a couple of items after this, too. Why don' t
you make it 1:30 and why don' t you get some orders from us?
PARKINS: All right, sir.
FOSMOEN: Do you want to move on this one?
FROMBERG: This Executive Session should take about a half hour, Mr. Parkins?
Okay, we'll go from 1:30 to 2:00 and we'll eat while we're while we're in
Executive Session.
SHOCKETT: What time is the Executive Session?
FROMBERG: 1:30 and at 2 o'clock we've got
DAOUD: Can't we take it at 1:00, Mal?
FROMBERG: Well, we may not be through here.
PARKINS: Mayor, that's 1 o'clock then for the Executive Session, is that
correct?
FROMBERG: No, I think you ought to make it 1:30.
PARKINS: 1:30.
FROMBERG: Let's go forward.
FOSMOEN: We have representatives here today from Land Design Research,
g Sy
Paumier who has been dealing with the design issues of the corridor studies.
Lou Goodkin and an associate of his are here to talk about housing market
absorption rates, particularly as they relate to South Pointe.
Jerry Rappaport and Bill Mahers are here from Halcyon Ltd. to discuss office
and commmercial market absorption rates as well as the financial strategies
properties to make development
that we'll use in beginning to assemble someg
cites available.
Also, Marty Leitner is here from Freilich and Leitner. They've been
extensively involved in coordiatingthe activitiesof y
that consulting team.
Let me introduce Sy Paumier who has some slides and a discussion of the
design issues relating to the Corridor studies and the public improvements.
PAUMIER: Thank you, Richard. The presentation will probably take about
ten to fifteen minutes. What we'd like to do is to kind of giveY ou an
overview. Obviously everybody in this room, I'm sure, is veryfamiliar with
the area, but I'd like to just kind of share
a e the process that we've gone
through over the last two months and how we've arrived at basicallysome
fairly specific development recommendations.
First off, there are, as you well know, many great resources both
natural and man-made in the area and there are a number of very strong
business enterprises in the area around which a total development
program can
be built. The corridors that we've put the most emphasis on are basically
Alton Road and Biscayne Street. These are the two major
� arterial streets
that are going to receive the most commitment. The area today has many, many
strong features, among those thearks and open spacesbe
p p that tend to along
the water's edge. The existing arterial street that runs parallel to the
ocean, Ocean Drive, is certainly one of the great resources that this South
Shore has but it today lacks amenity and a quality of environment. There are
many substantial structures along this corridor but there is no environment
and one of the considerations needs to be how do we improve the environment
for people in this particular area which today is so lacking in anyualit
q Y-
The Fifth Street corridor has been recognized for a long time in the
overall planning as a key zone for office and support commercial and the
recommendations you' ll see in a minute are focusing on trying to enhance that
corridor. There's already considerable investment going on in the area and
commitments are being made to major renovation of a number of buildings. The
M.B.REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY 2/20/85 PAGE 7
60 000449
PAUMIER (Cont'd) : The Alton Road corridor today is very underutilized,
underdeveloped, in many places does not have adequate off-street curbs and
there is no streetscape; overhead utilities and things of this nature tend to
mar the environment of the area. And certainly the most important area of
all, which is the Fifth Street intersection of Alton Road, is absolutely
lacking in any sense of entrance image. On the whole, the entrance coming
from Miami into this area really desperately needs to be announced at this
point.
The termination of where the corridor kind of ends at the ocean, today,
is certainly lacking. This particular park and open space could become a
great resource to the total South Pointe area, and we mention a number of
underutilized pieces of land throughout the area that need to be developed.
The infill opportunities are many, and we'll share those with you in a few
minutes.
There are a number of vacant sites in the zone and we would like to see
those become opportunities. Some of the negative things which are of concern
obviously are things such as the maintenance and care of things such as the
alleyways often which become very depressing zones. The so-calledp arks in
the area look a little bit like concentration camps because many of them are,
in fact, enclosed by fences and are very, very unattractivelaces for
people. �'
We see a number of situations like this where you see areas that look
like they're overgrown with no maintenance and signs saying "no dumping".
And throughout the area you see accumulations of trash in side yards and real
sense of no care for the environment. With this kind of quality it's very
difficult to anticipate investors wanting to come to an area
that is lacking,
in what I would say, some of the very basic maintenance issues. And then we
have the area of the public housing with its accompanying parking and if
you will, automobile kind of repair yard, in buildings many cases looking
like they've been shells for a long time. And other buildings
that have been
closed or not used any longer but give you that sense of nothing happening.
ha enin .
Now starting at the northwest corner of Fifth and Alton, the early marketing
studies that were done suggested that this was an ideal zone, that there were
a number of people interested in the possibility of building office space in
the area. Today, the area is certainly underutilized and contains a lot of
one and two story buildings, automobile parking, used car lots, things of
this nature, which suggests that this is really not a very, very prime
utilization of this very important land.
So basically, what we've done is, we've focused on this as probably the
single most important area. We think the school has greatp otential for
being renovated into a first class facility, and our current recommendations
are that that occur at that location. The school has certainly a historic
value and structurally appears to be in good shape but today again is very
Y
negative because of its condition. This is one of two basic . . fairly
definitive development plans. Now, these are not. . .we' re not trying just to
do a bunch of pretty pictures, we' re trying to do fairly accurate kinds of
development plans which illustrate what we think could he the proposed
development program.
As you can see along the Fifth Street corridor coming from Miami into
Miami Beach we' re showing basically as many as six sites for office
development of probably three to ten stories in height. Again, the dimension
of height is totally related to the parking structures or the parking
capacity, but we're basically showing buildings that have footprints of about
20,000 plus or minus square feet per floor and we' re showing again the
ability to accommodate probably, for the most part, four to eight story kind
of construction.
The red buildings are a part of the waterfront land next to the marina
which is . . . . we' re looking at currently as housing but again the office
development could continue southward if the developer ultimately feels that
that is a better utilization of that land. On the lower right you see the
school addressed, renovated with additional land for recreation adjacent to
the school.
Another alternative that we've looked at which we think is more positive
is moving the main entrance eastward about one block, away from Alton.
Otherwise Alton, you can see is in the middle left and that street would
become a part of the development site and both of the office buildings then
are basically on that piece of property on the left. . .lower left and on the
right we have basically the possibility of the open space or recreation area
adjacent to the school being a part of the so-calledatewa entrance to the
9 Y
total area. We feel it's absolutely essential that we do develop a strong
M.B.REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY 2/20/85 PAGE 8
60 000450
PAUMIER (Cont'd) : sense of entry off of Fifth Street into this total zone
referred to as South Pointe.
The kind of quality we'd like to see obviously are not necessarilyhigh-
rise
buildings but we'd like to see the architecture
close to the street with
a heavy landscaping on the outer edges as a way of creatinga strongsense of
quality and environment alongFifth Street
e and along Alton Road. We also
think it's important to do some good landscaping and develop a strong sense
of entrance image at that point with a combination of walls and landscaping.
Moving southward along the corridor, we're talkingabout putting
boulevard in. We expect and hope that some P ng a
of the land uses will change.
The water tower, as you know, will be replaced. Goingfurther
see the land currently owned bythe City south you can
on the left which will become
available in a few years. The total area is certainlyunderutilized '
very low-rise buildings, a tremendous with
amount of surface parking, warehouse
type uses, public housing project which we think is certainlynot '
or doing the best in terms of helping conducive
p ng that particular portion of land.
Looking eastward along Biscayne, and this particularlan
you see Alton RoadP shows, coming from
the upper left,
terminating in kind of a. . .if you will, a
bit of a traffic circle, then connecting eastward along
in the bottom left is a future site which would Biscayne. The site
c be in the place of Goodman
Terrace, hopefully a site for either a hotel or apartments. On
going up along the shore, we're showingbasicallythe left,
low-rise buildings along
the waterfront edge of approximately three to four stories mid-rise coming out of the back. It's e with mid-rise
the pinker buildings, are the high-
rise buildings. Those would be probably in the neighborhood '
stories and they would face on tog ood of six to ten
Alton, so we' re trying to step away from
the water with the lowest development along the t--
edge and then stepping
Where the current water tower is, g pptn9 hack.
we would recommend the possibility on
that corner, is an excellent site for a small office building ld�.nq and other
commercial uses.
Going eastward you can see the white buildingis
Restaurant and adjacent to him is another Joe's Stone Crab
infill parcel. The value of the
marina is yet not been recognized or certainly felt, but we do believe that
as has happened in a number of cities, the advent of a marina and
a strong
waterfront edge and high quality improvements, pedestrian improvements
the edge will, in fact, helpto entice the p along
h_ kind of uses that we think are
important, namely, indoor/outdoor relationships. Even if
p we have only
housing in the area, we need to have certainly ground floor uses such as this
one to make the waterfront exciting. Again, we talked about lower-rise
buildings next to the water but higher-rise buildings comingback from the
edge. We're trying to, in every case, require as part of the guidelines,
that the surface treatment of the parking deck, that will he
required,d, alwaysbe landscaped, so that anyhigh-rise or mid-rise
units would look down on a
landscaped parking rather then a deck.
Again, the concept which has been tested here in the area, the idea
o . . .along the major arterials, instead of the parking garages havinga face
on the road, we would expect and require re that we
q have two and three story
office uses, hopefully, to provide an edge to the parking rather than having
the parking garages come out on the street. We believe this is one of
the
great assets in the area, and this particular zone has been referred to as
where most of the commercial and retail uses would be focused from here going
eastward to the beach. As you can see there are several keysites available
r.
particularly on the left. The Cheezem
property on the right, also recommends
commercial uses. Turning the corner and going northward, we'veof an
underutilized block that's really verynegative. The9
park area today is
also, in our opinion, not contributing much and we think this could become
a
great asset to the area.
This plan we've developed here suggests that from Joe' s Stone Crab,
which is on the left, in the white building, that a series of infill
buildings, the yellow buildings, basically low-rise construction with the
exception maybe on Ocean Drive, that might be a mid-rise building. A major
parking garage will be required. We also think that in the waterfrontark
r use
that it would be ideal to have a majorP
not just t open space, and we're
suggesting the possibility of a restaurant in the park to help, again, bring
people and life.
9
The Biscayne S treet. . .we expect a small boulevard. We would hope to
accomplish an environment similar to this. Again, fairly heavy landscaping
p 9
on the edges. Internally, within the blocks, we think there should he
interior courtyards. In the park, itself, rather than the big lot which is
M.B.REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY 2/20/85 PAGE 9
60 000451
PAUMIER (Cont'd) : there today, We would much rather see the area devoted to
some real beauty. Absolutely needs to be a great park in the Pier Park area,
which is today very dull. The advantage of having a restaurant in there
would be that it would bring people to a use that's very important. It would
also provide revenue to the city which could then be used to help maintain
the parks and things that are created.
The last element is basically infill housing. We've been lookingat a
whole series of sites within the community. We focused
y basically on the
areas along the west edge, along Alton Road trying to figure out which of
these areas might provide the best opportunity for infill housing. One e of
the sites we've been looking at is a site that's currentlyowned bythe
We think that might be an idealplace for City.
some elderly housing when, in fact,
those buildings are no longer needed.
To the north you can see four different sites, half block, third blocks,
that whole area is fairly bleak today and there are as I mentioned am.
nu her
of vacent sites. What we're talking about and the marketingstudies suggest,
townhouse type densitie. We're talkingabout two 9d t�
and three story buildings
overtop of parking with landscape decks on top of the parkingand again
housing very similar in scale to that which is occurring q
all over the country
today. I don' t have a typical Florida example of this type of
is housing which is being built in the Baltimore/Washington YPthing. This area and again,
it's this kind of housing which we believe is desired and needed.e Again it's
happening with this case it's parking under the . We buildings. believe
it's happening in other cities it g elieve as
can happen here if we only set the guide-
lines for that type of development.
The overall plan we think is realistic. it focuses, as I mentioned, on
the Corridor along these two major streets and we think the last
step or the
next step is to try to provide the community and the developers with a little
better image of what it could be. We have to begin to raise
aise the standards
and the level of vision for people and by doing a number of studies
that
would really indicate the kind of quality that we expect to achieve that we
think that the developers of the private sector will in fact respond p nd to the
opportunity that you have here. Thank you.
FROMBERG: Okay, Gentlemen, let's get back up here.
GRENALD: In the audience we have from Chicago the President of the Boat
Show, Mr. Jeff Napier, a wonderful, dynamic plus for this cityand he's
s
really interested. Sitting out there looks like a college kid but
9 we
recognize him. Will you stand up, Jeff, please? (applause)
FROMBERG: Let me add to that the fact that this being the world's largest
boat show, the g
preliminary event with the NFL meetings to build up to the
boat show and the type of publicity that you have given to this community
with this really fabulous show is something that we're all veryproud of
and
we commend you. As we drive into this facility and we see the boats lined up
and then I see them along Purdy Avenue when I see them coming e
across the
Causeway, as long as I'm not behind them, it's great. }
(lau hter You've
(laughter)really done a fantastic job and we in this community reallyappreciate it.
Good. His comment was, he's just t p
J getting started. That's great.
ARKIN: We'll give you another half a million speed.
FROMBERG: We' re expanding the show just for you because we understood that
you wouldn' t come back without it, so this whole expansion of the Convention
Center program is just for you, Jeff.
GRENALD: Two things, he' s offered to give his expertise in two ,
laces in
P
the expansion of the Convention Center with input for users, and also with
the Marina, the establishment of the marina in which they have a4 reat deal
of knowledge. I think we should tap that as a great source of input.
FROMBERG: Thank you. Mr. Fosmoen, continue, please.
FOSMOEN: Yes, sir. Tom Powers and Lou Goodkin are here to discuss the
housingjust9aspects of this project, in price and absorption rates for housing.
Let me put this in context for a second. The objective of the study is
to obviously attract developers into this area. What we're doing is what a
developer would do if it was a hot market area. We' re setting design
desi n
standards so that developers are comfortable when they make an investment
M.B.REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY 2/20/85 PAGE 10
60 000452
FOSMOEN (Cont'd) : that the balance of that area is eventually going to come
up to a standard that's acceptable.
Secondly, we're providing the developers with information on the kind of
housing, price of housing and how quickly that can be absorbed. Number
three, we' re also looking at commercial and retail office absorption rates
and finally, for our purposes and the developer, we' re putting together a
series of financial packages so that they' ll know the kinds of services and
facilities and money incentives that we have to offer when they come to this
community to make their investment. So with that let me introduce Tom Powers
and then Lou Goodkin and we'll wrap it up with representatives from Halcyon.
We're trying to keep it within thirty-five to forty minutes.
FROMBERG: Okay. Let me say that the previous presentation was very
impressive.
TOM POWERS: I'm Tom Powers with the Goodkin Research Corporation. We were
retained to complete the market analysis, the ability analysis for the
residential components of South Pointe. Just very briefly in going over the
methodology that we used, obviously, we can't treat you as a suburban
development a la West Dade, Broward County perhaps or Palm Beach County. The
urban infield is a very different of a creature. You have to treat it very
differently. Consequently, we actually broke the work down into two
different levels. Number one, we have to know all we can possibly know about
what's happening in the Dade market place relative to the for sale product,
rental product and of course land sales. I say all we need to know, all we
can possibly know. We' re talking about product, product by type, what types
of amenities are necessary to attract people and particularly younger
worker-age households, interprojects, what type of amenity base is necessary
and what type of product and price levels that they' re responding '
y to. It's
s
important of course not only to know in Miami Beach what's happening but also
our competition obviously is in points west of. the City of Miami, in the
Kendall area in particular, and the Miami Lakes area.
Of course we have to pay a lot of attention to the secondary data,
migration. Because the richness of what happens in urban areas isn' t the
notion of people necessarily moving into and to consume suburban housing, but
the real richness is the velocity of movement into by younger people in
particular into urban areas to take advantage of housing. Migration of
people in this area and the movement of firms into this area obviously played
a very important part in our analysis.
To give an example, if you look at the majority of the work flow you
note that 20,000 people come to work in Miami Beach every day but they don' t
live in Miami Beach. That's opportunity. We can cater to that opportunity.
PP Y•
An additional 10,000 people migrate daily from South Broward County to work
in the City of Miami, that's additional opportunity that we can cater to.
FROMBERG: Excuse me. Let me go back over those statistics. You said 20,000
people come to work in Miami Beach each day. . . .
POWERS: That do not live.
FROMBERG: . . .that don't live in the City?
POWERS: Right. That is a potential opportunity, a potential market that we
can cater to, currently that we have to be aware of.
FROMBERG: What industries are these people involved in generally? What type
of jobs, hotels, hospital?
POWERS: Principally they' re service-oriented jobs. Certainly the government
here is a big employer. That type of a job. A service, hotel/motel, eating
and drinking establishments, , that type of thing.
There's this move-about-market and we' re firmly convinced that we' re
going to attract market and we will attract market here. We' re talking about
a market that lives in South Florida today as opposed to marketing product in
northeast for example, that kind of a thing. Just to wrap up my portion
here, we often, in particular economists, we tend to forecast housing
demands, and we tend to treat Dade County as something of a special creature,
noting that in fact for a county of 11.8 million, we' re only going to do
about 12,000/13,000 new for sale units in 1985, so the he demand for
M.B.REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY 2/20/85 PAGE 11
60 000453
POWERS (Cont'd) : new unit housing appears on the surface to be quite low.
In fact, if you look at the resale market in this county, you notice that
25,000 or 27,000 new or resale units will turn over in 1985. So the demand
for housing in Dade County is quite strong. It's alive and well. It simply
hasn' t really been catered to in particular by the depth of the builder
market for a lot of reasons. So to wrap it up then, we're convinced that if
Miami, in particular, the City of Miami matures, stronger job formation is
very much a plus for what's going to happen in South Beach, people wanting to
live in South Beach. We're convinced that real incomes will increased and in
fact have been increasing from 3% to 311% here in Dade County. That's
additional (inaudible) ability to afford. I don't know what the financial
markets are going to do in terms of interest rates but that's quite another
story.
So at any rate, I'll turn it over now with that background having been
laid, to Lou Goodkin, who will address the product.
FROMBERG: Mr. Goodkin, welcome.
LOU GOODKIN: Thank you very much. It's a pleasure. We're really excited
about the opportunities of South Pointe because when we look at this and I
am, of course, on record not being the most enthusiastic person when
commenting on the state of the luxury and the highrise market in South
Florida, particularly in Dade County. But when we looked at the opportunity
we have here at South Pointe, I think it's very encouraging. When we look at
the alternatives we are the most conveniently located address that an
individual working in the downtown corridor, looking for a coastal-oriented
location can respond to. And while we can be more affordable as opposed to
being. . .we' re not going really to be addressing the low price and the true
affordable, that's really the inland developments are going to be responsible
for that. But for people that are looking for an environment with close
proximity to work, the airport area and the downtown corridor, we' re in
excellent shape particularly in light of the alternatives that are in the
market place, the Grove which has very little land left for development, very
high-priced land, the Gables which has no real coastal development
opportunities, and when we look further north, it's not as conveniently
located as ours. It doesn't have the infrastructure to respond to the
market.
We took a philosophy after looking at this that while our long range
view was to look at more affordable housing product. So I can define what we
consider affordable and realistic here, would be in the $80,000 to $125,000
range, but it was our decision that the initial development should not be in
that range. But we should be focused on the Marina area and in the close
proximity to the Marina area with higher priced product that would be
exciting architecturally much more so than certainly the vertical
opportunities are elsewhere in Dade County, that we feel could address a
market that is qualified to both rent and purchase here that is not being
catered to at all. We recommended that the initial development phase be
rental units, renting in the range of $540,000 with views, to $975 a month
with views to $450 to $850 with views. We feel that there's a very strong
market for this and we assume that the 1986 market entrance with 180 units
projected an absorption rate of 15 to 20 units for nine months to one year
rental for that particular phase.
(COMMISSIONER DAOUD LEFT MEETING 12:40 P.M.)
FROMBERG: I'm sorry, would you go over that once more?
GOODKIN: Surely. Our first recommendation is to offer rentals adjacent to
the marina, and this product would be for non-view ranging from $450 a month
for a studio to $850 a month for a 2/2, for non-view; $540 to $975 for view
oriented, directly on the view. We said that 180 units would he the initial
phase, would have an absorption of 15 to 20 units a month or a nine month to
one year rental period. This is to be followed by for sale units ranging
from the one plus convertible den to a 2/2 plus convertible den with square
footage ranging from 1,050 to 1,400 square feet and with pricing ranging from
base pricing of $109,990 to $147,990 with the premiums for view, $132,990 to
$176,990. We recommended a 1987 pre-selling presence of 200 units and
projected an absorption for that product of ten units a month.
M.B.REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY 2/20/85 PAGE 12
60 000454
GOODKIN (Cont'd) : Now, one of the things that we had to consider is, if we
were going to spend dollars, let's say, to motivate people where we can
accomplish more by having a lower price or having a far more exciting product
that would be at a price that we feel the market would be responsive to. We
feel that the market is just loaded with vanilla type of product in various
ranges all the way up to several hundred thousand dollars. That isn't what
the market needs. What the market is calling for is something that younger
professional households, including a very substantial number of two-income
professional households would be responsive to. Not high-rise but mid-rise
over parking with much more of a residential thematic architecture, heavily
landscaped, more in tune with the type of the thing you'd see at a Marina
Del Ray which we refer to you in Southern California, that really builds on
its marina orientation.
Phase III we recommended two possible infill products including all two
and three-story townhouses that develop a density of 22 units or more an
acre, to go from $124,990 to $146,990 for one of those products to the
product closest to the marina to go from $152,990 to $200,000. This second
phase would only consist of 44 units. The first thing, or the more moderate
priced product would be the greater piece of property that would be for 75 or
more units. We felt that those 44 units, assuming a 1987 market entry, could
achieve an absorption of 3.66 units a month or one year sell-out for the 44
units. That's basically our report.
WEISBURD: Mr. Mayor.
FROMBERG: Just review one. Phase I is what?
GOODKIN: Phase I is rental. We start with that in a 1986 market entrance of
180 rental units.
FROMBERG: Okay. Phase II is?
GOODKIN: Is adjacent to that for sale condominium product, and that
consists of 200 units.
FROMBERG: Okay, and a price range of . . . .
GOODKIN: Price range. . .base prices from $109.990 to $147,990, and the
premium views would be from $132,990 to $176,990, approximately a hundred
dollars a square foot plus. . . . (unclear)
FROMBERG: Okay.
WEISBURD: Mr. Mayor.
FROMBERG: Commissioner Weisburd:
WEISBURD: I'm listening to the numbers and you were talking about affordable
homes or rentals or whatever, and we' re talking about young professionals
that are coming up and they're not making no $150,000 or $200,000. They' re
probably making closer to $35,000 to $50,000, and possibly with two incomes.
Are you telling me a combined household income of $50,000 let's say, could
afford $109,000 home or condominium?
GOODKIN: Tom in the back did a total qualification in terms of what would be
affordable. He could address that. One of the things I want to emphasize is
that we don't see this as being where the legitimate depth of the market is,
the programs we recommended. What we' re saying is, we feel it's critical to
make a very strong statement at the marina, closely adjacent to it, to set
the tone. We feel there is a market for that product. But in addressing the
market you're talking about, we have to get into that $80,000 to $125,000
range and that's going to be really with these infill product lines. But we
didn' t feel that the right strategy was to address that initially but to
address the things that are going to be tone setting, to make it highly
desirable. We did feel comfortable that there was in fact, enough market to
support the number of units that we projected for that which was basically
200, in the case of the vertical and 44 in the case of the townhouses.
M.B.REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY 2/20/85 PAGE 13
60 00045E
WEISBURD: My concern is this, that probably the first market that you' re
going to go after are Dade Countians and they probably have more reasonable
homes or rentals throughout Dade County. They're living somewhere and to get
them to come here for more money and be the pioneers, so to speak, because
it's a renovated new area, I think that could be a
tough job.
g
SHOCKETT: I don't. I think that we have so much to offer . . ..
FROMBERG: Let's hear from the expert then we'll. . . . .
GOODKIN: I am very sensitive to what you're saying, but I think that we have
to appreciate that the alternatives that these people have that would want to
live in a good coastal location that has the kind of environment that we can
offer, and particularly, the kind of product we envision, is not being
offered in the market place. It will be far more exciting architecturally,
yet good value. The type of numbers we're talking about are the numbers per
square foot that a lot of these projects that came on the market in the
$150,000 and $160,000 range actually ended up reducing their product in
order to sell. So I mean the value is excellent for what it is. But if you
look at the Key Colony type of an opportunity where. . .in Key Biscayne where
they have substantially higher land costs because we have clients that have
major holdings there and we have the Grove. . .certainly there are plenty of
opportunities in the northern part of Miami beaches. There's plenty of major
pieces. However, we found that in the case of the waterways, and that's more
in the direction we have to go, when we hit the pricing that was like $80,000
to $150,000 at the waterways, we started getting a substantial number of
young people that did respond to the waterways and that pricing. In fact,
interesting enough, the most popular selling product at the waterways in
North Miami is townhouses with a garage. Those particular townhouses are
selling in that $135,000 to $150,000 range, getting young people and
certainly if you look at where they work, they find it much more convenient
to live in this area. If we are talking about this being where all of our
product go, I'd be very concerned. But we' re very comfortable that there's
enough demand that we could confortably sell the number of units we're
talking about.
WEISBURD: My only concern was there's such a gof apartments and rentals and
condominiums throughout the county and I don't thi nk. . .well, there's a lot of
people moving into the State, I don' t know if they're necessarily moving into
Dade County as much as the northern part of the State. But we have to
attract those people down but I think at this point our concentration is
going to be to get the Dade County young, upward, mobile, professionals that
work downtown Miami to want to live on Miami Beach because of the proximity
of their work, so they can take five or ten minutes to get to work instead of
being locked up in traffic for an hour and a half.
FROMBERG: I think that's what he said. Commissioner Arkin.
ARKIN: I think that you talking about so few units in these phases. You' re
talking 44 units, 200 units. It's very minor. I think what Lou is telling
you is that the initial impact has to be fantastic and then the lower income
housing will appear in the smaller lots inside and that will be where you' ll
start housing those people but I'm sure it's a necessity to create the
environment that will bring people here.
GOODKIN: It really is. It's a situation where we have to give people a
reason. If it's pricing in itself, they have lots of alternatives. What we
have to do is give them an alternative from the standpoint of the product and
the environment. I think starting with our marina project. . .we have all the
basis, the cultural opportunities here, the proximitey to work, the fact that
a Rouse, . . .what they're going to do is going to enhance our situation. It's
not going to compete with i t.
ARKIN: I think it's do-able.
GOODKIN: Yes. So we're very positive about that. The other thing, of
course, we identify in here which is a pretty critical subject is that unlike
the gentrification programs that typically have occurred in urban areas where
they' re trying to enhance them. We have very high land costs in South Beach.
M.B.REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY 2/20/85 PAGE 14
0 i"45
6
GOODKIN (Cont'd: I mean, the people are talking about prices that are higher
than areas that are considered to he quite desirable that are north of us.
That's the problem because it's one thing to talk about moderate price
housing and it's another thing to say if people are talking about $15 and $20
a square foot numbers you can't address moderate price housing. So that's an
area we have to be very sensitive in attacking.
ARKIN: It's going to be our biggest problem.
FROMBERG: Gentlemen, we have to move along. Any other questions of
Mr. Goodkin?
WEISBURD: Wish you lots of luck.
SHOCKETT: I would like just one other comment. You can't really just talk
in terms of price. A $100,000 home with suitable financing, with a low down
payment and a long term mortgage can be something that's very affordable. So
those things enter into it as well.
GOODKIN: Plus the fact there are some people. . .I mean, if you look at what
has happened in the Grove, as an example, which I remember sitting in
meetings when there was a lot of concern about the Grove. I remember when we
did a townhome project there how we made 15 foot walls and security and all
of the things that were concerned there and the Grove has become, in a very
short period of time, a highly desirable high ticket item, getting people
from the Gables that lived in bigger houses and has one of the best mixes as
far as market. You have Latin, you have Jewish, and you have non-ethnic
population have responded to the communities there which is quite unusual.
Hasn't occurred. I think we do have that opportunity.
FROMBERG: Okay, thank you. The main message is that there is a demand out
there for what you're proposing and that's the encouraging. . . . . .Mr. Fosmoen.
FOSMOEN: Two other aspects. One is the commercial and office market and
the other is the financing packages that we will be presenting to developers
in conference. Let me introduce Bill Mahers from Halcyon.
BILL MAHERS: I just want to say that Halcyon is really encouraged to hear.
Lou Goodkin's remarks and part of what we're looking at requires a strong
residential base particularly the retail component, though his positive
findings are really helping us out.
Just to summarize, we think the long term. . . .
FROMBERG: Excuse me
dust one second. Are we going to get a copy of the
report that you were referring to, Mr. Goodkin? Okay, thank you. Please.
MAHERS: We think the long term prospects for office development in South
Pointe area are very good. We've been researching this for about two months
now and have been working in Miami for about two or three years. What we
envision is a series of 60,000 to 120,000 square foot buildings along Miami
Beach Boulevard starting at the Biscayne Bay side, and we've been working
closely with Land Design Research. You see these types of buildings and the
placement of them reflect in the plans that Sy Paumier was showing.
Basically two sources demand for the office space in the South Pointe
area. First there's corporate offices and that includes both front office
space and back office space. Let me just explain that a little bit. Front
office space is a headquarters situation where a company would want to put a
regional headquarters, or a local company who would want to build its
headquarters in the South Pointe area. There is demand for that and just as
an aside there are several major corporations currently considering the South
Pointe area as an office location and the City is working closely with them.
In addition, there's the back office space concept which is the clerical
and commputer operations of financial institutions. At the current time it
looks like that's not a viable demand segment because companies like to put
these offices near where their employees live and basically they' re going to
the West Dade area. But as the area develops as a major residential . . . as
the infill developments succeed and as the Cheezem development and the other
developments we' re talking about work, it will become a significant
residential area and therefore could support back office space.
M.B.REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY 2/20/85 PAGE 15
60 000457
MAHERS (Cont'd) : The second component of the office market is professional
companies including lawyers, accountants, consultants, architects, and they
kind of fall into the same category as the back office space and we certainly
can see them moving to a mixed use, high amenity with the marina and the
shops there, that sort of environment. They will be looking for a
residential base; and just to qualify that a little bit, we do think that
Cheezem's development and the demand that the Goodkin Company's been able to
find, we think there will be a residential base established in fairly short
order and we're looking. . , we think that the office market will benefit
significantly from that.
A couple of steps are needed to attract this demand. First of all, for
the corporate headquarters and corporate space, you need available land,
infrastructure improvements, including parking, a good image and visibility
coming off the causeway, but all in all we think Miami Beach Boulevard is a
good location for this type of corporate development. And as I said in the
professional office market you need high quality residential and retail
environment to make this an attractive mixed-use environment.
On the retail side and what we're looking at and what we're recommending
is that we envision and we're pretty confident about, creating a restaurant
district in the southern part of South Pointe, building on Joe's Stone Crab
and Crawdaddy's which is going to be built in the new park. We think there
could easily be five or six high quality restaurants that would attract
people from all over Dade County to come to the South Pointe area. Joe's
Stone Crab already does a great business for six months of the year and the
fact that people are willing to come to the area now, we think that if it was
fixed up in the way it's supposed to be fixed up, it' ll become just a great
restaurant district, not so much competing with Bayside which will be more
fast food oriented than restaurant.
And then, finally, we see a demand for about approximately 100,000
square feet of service retail catering to the local residents that move to
the South Pointe area and this is your groceries, dry cleaners, all sorts of
day-to-day retail needs that they're going to need as they move in. That's
it.
FROMBERG: Thank you. Any questions? Thank you very much. It looks like
everything is encouraging.
PARKINS: As we had expected, sir.
FOSMOEN: Barry Rappaport will follow.
BARRY RAPPAPORT: One of the major things we want to do out of our study was
to take market information and the design ideas and apply them to actual
specific sites. We want to avoid condemnation at all costs and would like to
try to work with the existing landowners or the existing city land to try to
be able to offer to a developer, at a price so that he could build his
product to meet this demand. We have gone and talked to a lot of the
landowners about what their prices are and what they're visions are for the
area and we've gotten a lot of support to be involved in having their
properties offered out to the development community. We've come up with that
there are some people who have a little bit of a high value for their land
but in general we look at the consistent average square foot land price.
Most of the project can be basically feasible. However, because we' re
searching for higher housing costs, because the office market isn't
established, in the initial couple of developments we are coming through to
recognize that there's going to be a need to write down the land cost a
portion, similar to what is called UDAG gap financing that is done on a
Federal basis as well as provide community parking that will allow some of
the developments not to have to bear that parking cost on their project.
Right now, working through those numbers that we could give the developers
confidence that not only do we like the market and the design plan but that
when they do come in here that they can make a reasonable profit competitive
with other project opportunities they have around the area.
GRENALD: (Inaudible - off microphone)
RAPPAPORT: We don' t expect to use UDAG. We expect to use the available
resources and tax increment financing and perhaps within the parking bonding
M.B.REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY 2/20/85 PAGE 16
60 00045
RAPPAPORT (Cont'd) : capacity of the City in the same technique. What TTSA
G
Psubsidy
tries to do is use the minimum amount of public e
necessary to leverage
most amount of private development that you would expect to recommend.
FROMBERG: Okay, Gentlemen, any other questions? Thank you.
FOSMOEN: One comment, Mr. Mayor, which is really a policy recommendation to
the Commission and we've discussed it with the South Pointe Subcommittee
well as some of the Commi tt ies of RMB as
There was considerable discussion
about trying to relocate the South Shore ElementarySchool. I
all picked up in SyPaumier's � hope that you
presentation that we're beginning to believe
that that property should be preserved and renovated where it is.
discussion about trying to relocate it to There was
the police station site. I can get
into a long dissertation with you about opportunities but ut we think that
there's a greater opportunity to preserve that school, and in
fact use the
police station site as a development opportunityrather than '
long ardguous battle of acquiring fighting that
q g additional land around the police station,
getting exemptions from the State to build an undersized school
putting a school where it maybe a and in fact
prime development site. So that's one of
the policy kinds of issues that's surfacing through this and
to be aware of that.
g I just want you
FROMBERG: Okay. Mr. Parkins, anything else with regard to your y ur report?
PARKINS: The only remaining item was the Housing
Authority negotiations. We that they' re currentlydrafting for discussion
a contract which
incorporates the basic principles that were laid outt'
n the letter of
understanding that was discussed in January, 1985 witho
attempted to contact Mr. Perlin to see if he y u• We have
can get a copy of that contract
over today in accord with Commissioner Shockett's request. He had
to see, I think, a draft of that document q expected
today. I don't have an answer for
you yet, sir. We will by 2 o'clock.
SHOCKETT: Mr. Fromberg, I'd like to comment on thisar.ticul
just before I get to it, I do have one otherP ar issue but
comment about the South Pointe
invitation. I think when they list the Agencymembers that
list and name the AgencyAttorneyand they ought to
the Agency Secretary.
Let me tell you, the last meeting we had a month ago when Mr. Perlin
present, they had this letter of intent or memorandum ofwas
proposed agreement
and we went through it in fair amount of detail with Mr. Perlin to see if the
Housing Authority was willing to give, in exchange for concessions from the
City, . . . .
FROMBERG: Before these gentlemen leave, excuse me. Gentlemen,
for your efforts and we thank you for we thank you
your report. You' re confirming in a
very tangible way what we've been led to believe all along, but I
everybody to understand, as I'm sure the Commission want
does, that these reports
are necessary in order to make a direct positive presentation to developers
rather than in theory but in expert opinion and reporting, P
P g, and this is, I
assume is the basis of the report to the Developers' Conference that's
to take place shortly. going
PARKINS: That's correct, sir.
FROMBERG: We thank you for your work and we'd like to see in writing copies
of whatever you make available as soon as it's available.
M.B.REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY 2/20/85 PAGE 17
40 000459