1674-22 Pancoast Family Interview with • • - Pancoast . arandson of John Collins. done
by Polly Redford , March 30 1967:
its riaht as far as he knows.
Merchantville, Nj about miles from Moorestown -- Pancoast
home town. Collins financed Collins & Pancoast for son-in-law.
Sold coal . lumber , agri products, auto agency, hardware.
John Collins was orig founder of NJ hart sox and prosperous
Financed each of sons and his son-in-law to put into business.
Lester was not married then; put in charae of farms. Allowed
, Collins to come to Florida in. winter. Arihur stayed in old
1 Collins homestead in Moorestown . farmed that and had a nursery
bussiness in addition to that. Irving was put into same
business as Pancoast but in Moorestown. He later branched out.
Collins made wild investment in mining (gold?) in North
Carolina mountains; lost that. Invested in Miami Beach in 1882;
lost that. With this background , despite being prosperous, had
invested a great deal of capital in various businesses. Once
decided he would make things grow properly in Miami Beach ,
x~l ' would have to furnish water in a dry period. And he would have
have to sprinkle the entire grove. He grew crops in-between
(62) trees. Expensive thing. Grew tomatoes and potatoes between
avacado trees. He was a scientific hortoculturist. He was a
^ ~^ pioneer in devl tangle black and blueberries in NJ. He knew had '
~~— to grow special pear to send to England.
Knew about early and late fruits; understood marketing of
fruits. When he saw black , sandy soil and he was used to that
kind of soil and knew anything would grow in it if you cvould
fertilize and water it . . . when he saw that on the west side of ,
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(:1 --QIndian Creek , he decided he could grow avocados there. Felt no
frost would bother him. Had a premonitifon that was good.
Was around 70 when started. He came here in 1904, bought more
of land in 1909: planted first avocados in 1907. He was 75 in
1913.
He didn 't have ready cash so he went to children to loan him
mon6y for Miami Beach. After all , he had set them up in
business. There was no question in his mind that they would
. have to do it. But they were a little cautious by this time.
They said they would like to come and see. Lester , Arthur and
wife, Irving and wife, my father and mother got on boat either
in Philly or New York and went to Havana and then came back.
Ferry ran to Knight 's Key from Havana; Flagler hadn 't run
railroad south to Key West yet .
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I don 't know for a fact , but went to Knight 's and probably took .
railroad up to Miami . That was 1911 ; what time of year I don 't
know; probably wasn 't summer. They stayed 3 or 4 weeks, in
Miami , at Halcyon Hotel . Went by boat to beach. Sandy strip on
oceanfront , starting on what is now about 3rd street there were
tall and short coconut trees. From planting operation started
by company in which my grandfather interested (Field and Henry
Osborn) (There were a lot of other people in this company --
about 60) South of 14th Street would have been grove started by
Lum. Sandy strip was very narrow at south end; mangrove shore
east of Indian Creek. Shallow parts of Indian Creek important
because that ' s where crocodiles and sea life lived. West of
that is what we called high pine land. Black sand there about
18 feet deep. Varied in depth, deeper as we went north. At 41
St. where farm started , it about 18 feet.
From there west , very high mangrove. Among highest mangrove I
know of . I have photographs of it. (shows pix . ) One taken 1910.
Man who made these photos is Matlack. Made up books of pix for
anyone who wanted. This is Alligator Hole; we call it Crocodile ,
Hole lots of times. Only a few blocks north of Firestone
Estate. (Note Arva: no mention of Allison Island. ) Palmetoes ,
then pines, then mangroves. MAtlock may not have been here that
early; these may be some he collected himself . �
Farm at 41 st. Planted pine trees in two rows, farm vehicles
would go up and down between them. . . . that 's how we got Pinetree
Drive. Start canal at south end of Indian creek , then aim for
Miami as straight as could go. Spoil bank became a road. (Dade
K ^�
Blvd. ) This eventually determined location of Collins Bridge.
Couldn 't use north end ,of Indian Creek because boats kept
getting Stuck in bay; too shallow.
Collins family was Quaker far back . John Pancoast was a Quaker .
Family, which came down in 1911 , were all Quakers. Were non-
conservative; might have a piano, etc. , more on liberal side.
Women didn 't talk much about it to me, but my dad did. Wasn 't
so bad over in Miami but over there, it was a wild country.
Mosquitoes. They looked over farm and decided that there might
*be some prospects but didn 't want to pour a lot of money into
it. Didn 't think prospects were good enough; they had their own
prospects back home and would rather put there money in that.
END TAPE A, PANCOAST #1
They would rather be on the ocean than the bay, they were sure
of that. This is where the whole thing starts. Shall we put the
money into the farm or shall we turn it into real estate so
people can build over here. This is what they talked about when
they went back to the hotel in the evening. Even before they
left for Miami , they decided they would be willing to give my
grandfather money from the businesses if he would build a
bridge across the bay. My grandfather agreed; quoted: "yes,
;this could 'become another Atlantic City. " In my opinion , it was
the family that decided it should become a real estate•
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development in preference to a farm development. Why Thomas
Pancoast? He and my mother only ones willing to go, a
challenge. He was director of a bank , etc. , no reason for him
to move out. No women ever wanted to come to Miami in those
days. Three boys: Arthur , Norman , Russell . Member of family
stayed in same place 200 years. Rest of family (Collins) would
not go. Irving would also run Merchantville store. Collins made
wife stay home when he would come to Miami in the winter. After
a while, he did. Had unmarried daughter Mary and wife down to
Hypoluxo where they had cottage. They didn 't come on down to
Miami until after farm was started. Then they would stay at
Halcyon Hotel .
Pancoast came down in 1911 , went home to plan move. Put Russell
with aunt and uncle for completion of school year: 1912-1913?
Came down in middle of school nevertheless. Lester got married ,
decided to go to Florida during winter , took Russell with them.
They say this was 1914; I always thought it was 1913. Joined
8th grade in Miami , probably Jan. or Feb. of 1914; that 's
shortly after Lester got married. So came down in December or
so of 1913. We stayed in Miami ; that summer my mother went
north to close house up north , move furniture down in
preparation for house being built on beach. Started house
before road connected between bridge and beach.
(tape goes blank for a while -- voices very faint in
background. )
Where didthey expect to get real estate customers to come to
this remote place? People from north coming to North Florida
since 1850. Here it was different; now it was accessible.
FLAGLER BUILT HIS RAILRdAD. Fisher was good advertising man. He
knew how to merchandise. Our thought would have been to be
something nice and people would want it because it was nice.
But you can just go so far if you don 't have a merchandiser,
Fisher had this inherently; we recognized that. Unowned land by
our family and by Fisher , we went together 50-50 basis and
formed the Bayshore Company. It owned a hell of a lot of land.
We didn 't market it; we let Fisher do that. We did a lot of the
Iwork , he sold it through the Fisher organization. It was all
under his name; a lot of people didn 't ./now we were 50 percent
owners of Bayshore lands.
Bayshore Company filled considerably into bay; bought land from
Field. Owned a lot personally. When company went defunct , Field
still held title to land he bought. Didn ' t know where shoreline
was. Mangroves caused meander line. Within meander line was
Bulf Island with shallow water to beach mainland. When decided
to develop Bull Island , hulkeaded and filled it , deepened water
between island and beach. Then II board said don 't own island
because we made deep water. Went to Tally and bid island. Never
thought of ecology of bay. It was part of conquering wild part
of U. S.
Collins/Pancoast quite dissimilar ; two contrasting
personalities' Two were necessary to each other. Pancoast
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. needed Fisher ' s money. Fisher was flamboyant. He could sell . �
Pancoast/Collins gave it senAibility , business accumen. Most �
| talented was Irvin Collins. My father was more interested in �
' doing right for -"0 �unity rather than lining pockets. Before �
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and after the � /m, father spent 2/3 of time working for every .
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organizatior � lat would help quality of beach. Fisher needed :
someone t^�.~-o that because he couldn 't. If Fisher had never �
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would hcc::' come along , what would have happened? Whole thing
would have been much slower but I don 't think anything could ,
have stopped it.
Collins family got outside capital from local banks, credit
through northern businesses. Advanced credit there, used money �
here. Sell small pieces, etc. Always did development first. If
isher hadn 't taken land from ocean to bay and cleared it at �
one time, it helped us. We couldn 't afford to do that . People �
L/ still would have thought of it as a mosquito haven. The fact :
that you could see across made you realize how much land was .
there. �
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Firestone bought a big chunk from us. Other people were �
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interested who never had any contact with Fisher. This was .
before Fisher ever got going. Lummus put on first subdivision �
in 1912; Fisher later on. Money to clear it was loaned to �
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Lummus from Fisher . Lummus ' had political influence in Miami : �
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southern bank and trust company loaned us money. �
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"Palm Beach was settled by people of second generation money �
while Miami Beach was settled by people of first generation �
money. " Lot of first generation money was gained- by people who �
earned it on the growth of the automobile and its byproducts. .
(Fisher , Allison , Firestone, Wood, etc. ) Fisher didn 't build an '
oceanfront hotel , nor did he have oceanfront property for sale.
END TAPE B COAST .��- .
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Fisher thoughtfront was better than saltspray ocean front , �
^tays Redford. R: ��Thonds Pancoast: no one ever built on bayfront. '
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when fisher go ' ' hat property, idea was' to attract people �
here. so he lt hotel there. Nautilis was started for same
reason. Nobodbuilt that way unless something was being done. �
Pancoast says Fisher didn 't have oceanfront property of
| consequence. Also, Fisher was a boatman and the bay was better
for handling boats than ocean. He built a hotel on Lincoln Road �
in order to start some things on Lincoln Road.
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He left Beach in 1957 because getting practically no work on �
/ beach. Jewish people didn 't come to us; or if did , fees were
too high to pay. It wasn 't religious entirely, although that �
might have had something to do with it . Area in which our house
was located began to net too commercialized. We were within two
blocks of ocean and never saw it. �
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PERIOD OF GIANTS -- Boomers. Combo of personalities that made �
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this place so fantastic. Sewell , Fisher , Collins, Merrick. Once
` ^ a developer loses control , and he loses control when a
community is incorporated -- it then is a political problem of
handing people. It 's a question of the wiseness of the
political leaders and the developers and how much he can
influence them. Most people couldn 't see far enough to know
zoning , roads, etc. No one visualized that all the residence
property on the ocean would become hotels.
END PORTION OF TAPE A' PANCOAST #2
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Interview with Russell Pancoast
May 15, 1967
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